TALKING SHOP: Lister Horsfall’s northern powerhouse

Fourth generation family jeweller Lister Horsfall has been serving the people of Halifax since 1902. Today’s owner Nick Horsfall spoke with Watch Insider’s Daniel Malins about adapting to modern luxury retail, the secrets behind the company’s longevity, and why this is certainly not Lister Horsfall’s last tango in Halifax.

Watch Insider: How do you strike the right balance between leveraging your position as an independent jeweller and the flexibility that comes with it, versus not having the resources of a major chain?

Nick Horsfall: Having worked with certain bigger companies as well, the benefit of an independent is its independence. You can pick up on something and move quicker and often there’s just one decision maker within the business, rather than it being a board of directors. With big decisions and investments on what we have in our shop, it all rests with one person. I think retail over the last 10 years has become a bit generic, even on the independent front. They all start to look the same. But one of the main positives is the quicker moving relationships that we can create as a business with our clients. I think that’s imperative and a lot of our clients buy into that.

One of the cons as an independent is we’re trying to solve the same problems, but we’re all doing it independently of each other. As a business leader and owner, unless you’ve got a really strong, challenging team, it can be quite difficult to pull all the facts together to get a steer on what to do. We’ve been very fortunate that over the last five years we’ve found ourselves in a very strong industry. We are historically a very hand-to-mouth industry, if I’m honest. I know it doesn’t look like that from the outside, but the level of investment that we have to make in inventory or a shopfit tends to be very closely linked to what we make — a little bit like tax and salaries. We’ve just had this bumper time which has taken a lot of the top end independents from smaller family-run businesses to medium-sized companies. And that’s been a big change, which we’ve all had to adapt to.

WI: It’s interesting what you say about the investment that you’ve got to put back into the business for shop refits or inventory or whatever it may be. From the data crunching I’ve done, a lot of the time operating profit is pretty random relative to turnover.

NH: Yes, I think turnover and profitability can be two very different things in our industry. Branded boutiques, for example, can be fantastic for profile, partnership, and customer experience, but they are not always straightforward profit generators.

Over the last few years, particularly with watches, we have all invested heavily in stock, showrooms, and brand expectations. That has brought opportunity, but it has also meant retailers have had to work hard to maintain their own identity. I think the market has now taken a natural breath. There has been some contraction, but I would say it feels more realistic than worrying — a return to a more sustainable level after an exceptional period.

A lot of our competitors are the same, but we’re in a totally different world to where we were four years ago. The only thing that we’re feeling as a business is that everything else is catching up and squeezing the margin.

WI: You mentioned the homogenisation of stores over time. How avoidable is that?

NH: I think previously shopfits were probably once every 15–20 years in our industry. When I first started, it was something that you did very infrequently and now I think it’s an ongoing process of improvement. You never really stop. We’ve just completed an RCPO [Rolex Certified Pre-Owned] area in Halifax, which meant adapting a part of the showroom that had been developed relatively recently. It’s constant, but is it avoidable? I think it is, if you go and get the right advice. We used a great designer that’s helped us and he took us on a bit of a journey and I feel very proud of what we’ve actually created in our new showrooms, particularly Halifax. Halifax is a flagship, not only for us, but potentially for what independent and provincial town retail can look like. I think we were very fortunate to have quite a lot of space to work with, and we’ve used the benefits of that to provide something which I don’t think exists in our trade at the minute.

Shopfits were probably once every 15–20 years in our industry. Now I think it’s an ongoing process of improvement.”

WI: You mentioned the isolation you can feel as an independent jeweller, but am I right in saying that you’re now involved in an official capacity with Houlden buying group?

NH: Yeah, I’m a director of the group now.

WI: Can you elaborate on what that involves and how it’s benefited you?

NH: It benefits us a great deal because we get out of our showrooms. I’ll be at [Northampton jeweller] Michael Jones on Monday, so it makes us go out of our shops and see what other people are doing. Sometimes it’s really helpful from a benchmarking point of view. I’ve been very fortunate to go behind the scenes in a lot of amazing businesses. You go to Weirs and you see how they do it, or Lunn’s in Belfast, which is just a behemoth of a business, and see how they’ve done it. You pick the bits that make you think: “We should do that.’ And you think you can also pick the bits that you don’t want to do, because they’ve all had the growth already and sometimes there’s bits of it that you probably would do differently.

Of course, there’s a potential risk that we all end up dealing with the same suppliers. Some of these brands have been around a long time and when they come to the surface and get recommended by other retailers it cuts out a lot of wasted time.

WI: On the subject of your suppliers, you say that you’re constantly looking for advice from your peers in the industry, plus personal relationships you’ve had with individuals over the years will play a part too. But, ultimately, aren’t you looking for those brand partners that can support you with marketing spend?

NH: My feeling pre-2007 was that there were emerging brands and there were customers willing to take more risk. This generation especially is very brand focused. We are fortunate that we work with the ‘pillar brands’ and we get the benefits from them in terms of the level that they work at, so we’re not actively looking to increase our brand portfolio.

WI: When you’re dealing with your VIP customers, which way does it flow in terms of chicken and egg? Do you try and persuade you to stock certain rare or obscure brands? Or does it go the other way, whereby they ask you for advice about what they should buy next for their collection?

NH: Yeah it goes the other way. I mean, there’s only one brand above the brands that we carry that potentially becomes a conversation that people want to have at some point. And I don’t know if it’s the same in London, but our clientele are relatively conservative. They’re an aspirational bunch up here. It’s not this hotbed where everyone wants something a bit different. People aspire to have a certain brand of car, they’ll have a certain brand of watch if they live in a certain area. If people say: “I’d love a Patek,” then I just say that that’s not a relationship that we have.

WI: When you make reference to Patek Philippe, do you feel like you’re missing out on taking someone to that final step of their watch collecting journey?

NH: I think every collector’s journey is personal, and there are some exceptional brands for people to discover along the way. What we tend to see, though, is that Rolex remains a constant. Collectors may explore different brands and categories, but Rolex often continues to be the reference point within their collection. It has a remarkably broad appeal and a reputation that stands the test of time.

I don’t particularly like going shopping, so when I find myself in an environment where I feel like I feel recognised and I feel valued, it puts me at ease.”

WI: When you spoke earlier about the endless heavy investment you’ve got to make as a store, do you ever consider that it really future-proofs you? You’re a fourth generation family jeweller, so succession would be on your mind at some point, presumably.

NH: It’s already a conversation that we have now because of the levels of investment and the timeline that that creates to actually make it worthwhile. I’ve got three kids, but my eldest is 12. A 10 year plan means that you’ve got a 22 year old, and although I’m not going to presume he’s going to go into the business, there’s suddenly a conversation to be had or a thought process is starting before you make the investment.

WI: Which way round does that go though? Does that inspire you to invest more or does it make you obsess over profitability?

NH: You only ever feel like a custodian in a family business. I know that sounds like a bit of a cliche, but at the end of the day previous generations have run the business, and they made right decisions and possibly lots of wrong decisions, but overall the business has succeeded. And that that responsibility gets put on most family business succession. There’s a real pride in having a showroom which is new and developing or changing.

I have a bit of a saying that, if you keep asking the same question, you’ll get the same answer. So, once we had those early successes by doing something different, we became more confident in making the investment going forward to then reap the benefits afterwards. What we’ve done in Halifax is pretty major and an accountant probably wouldn’t have looked at it as making business sense, but it came from a gut feeling. A feeling of protecting what we already have rather than looking for more. I’m really pleased with the overall outcome.

Sometimes in family businesses the success is in terms of the business carrying on, and there’s not so much of a pat on the back. But from a career point of view, having done that showroom, I do feel quite proud of what I’ve actually achieved in my little time in the business. I think it represents what retail can be as an alternative to the city centre. The high street, as we remember it, is no longer about footfall in most towns. Most towns and cities in Britain now are on a decline, and the only main businesses that you see as a success are the jewellery businesses. Your gents outfitter is no longer there. I live in Ilkley and it’s got all these little independents and I think it’s got a nice feel about it. But I go up and down the country and look at other towns and other towns that you’d think would be a success but aren’t.

The same could be said about shopping centres. Southampton now is dominated by a big shopping centre. It’s nice, don’t get me wrong, but you don’t necessarily get the same experience. A lot of the multiples exist in shopping centres now, but the style of shopping is going to be different. My personal opinion is that the level that we are at makes the experience akin to a nice restaurant — people look forward to going to it.

WI: How do you achieve that level?

NH: The environment is important. I don’t particularly like going shopping, so when I find myself in an environment where I feel like I feel recognised and I feel valued, it puts me at ease. Once I’m at ease, I’m much more susceptible to spending. It’s the same as your favourite pub. If you go into a pub and the guy knows what you’re having to drink then you feel like you belong, rather than being five deep at the bar trying to get someone’s attention. Having this environment that people feel welcome in is important, especially in a world of luxury, which can be daunting a lot of the time. We’ve got locks on the doors and people that they’re going to be judged. The reality is most jewellers are not looking down the nose at people — they’re just like us.

But other than creating these environments where people feel comfortable, the biggest challenge is getting them in. We have developed a decent sized hospitality area, and we’re going to do regular in-house meals with customer ambassadors, where they can bring friends. We’ll extend it to wider networks rather than just business people we work with as well, to try and get people to come into the showroom. Not to sell to them, but just to show them who we are. Letting them know that, if you need to speak to someone, this is a point of contact, and if we never see you again, thank you very much for coming. So I think the future of retail for us is that slower pace. It’s not necessarily waiting for people to come in and just pack and wrap and off you go. It’s very much going to be someone coming in and spending two to three hours in the showroom and hoping that they’re going to go away and think: “Why would I ever go anywhere else?”

WI: Would you get in a chef to put some food together or is it just champagne?

NH: Yeah, we do that. We have a full-time mixologist on site. Our experience with our customers is that people tend to come and they want to stay. Another big thing that we added to the Halifax showroom was we have private secure parking on site, so clients can come and park at the showroom and come and go discreetly. I think that is a massive benefit because if your customers are always looking at their watch because the parking metre is running down then that always adds a little bit of the pressure. You want them just to be relaxed and enjoying themselves.

When I’m with a client, I always sell on emotion. I struggle with clients who start quoting movement references and this and that and the other.”

WI: How often are you in the store? Are you constantly there or do you delegate that to store managers?

NH: Yes, so I’ve got Gemma Moody as MD. Since I moved three years ago, I thought I’d spend more time in the showroom and I’ll be honest, I haven’t. I’ll probably be at the Halifax store two to three times a week. More and more I need a reason to be there. I don’t jump in the car to drive an hour to sit in my office on the off chance that I’m needed. And that has helped with Gemma’s role and her capacity to deal with a lot of the day-to-day.

But with your phone, wherever you are, you’re in contact. People can reach out to you and on WhatsApp we have customers and clients, plus we use it a lot internally as well. It’s very phone-based.

WI: I want to ask you about watchmakers and how difficult or easy they are to find. I hear all the time that there aren’t enough qualified watchmakers to deal with the quantity of watches in circulation.

NH: We’ve got three watchmakers in our Halifax showroom. So one of the things I want to do, for my own personal benefit as well, is lift the bonnet on a watch. I want to actually show what’s going on in there. It still blows my mind how fine it is. And I don’t really know of any other industry that would work on such fine quality.

When I’m with a client, I always sell on emotion. I struggle with clients who start quoting movement references and this and that and the other. I glaze over!

WI: Do you have a view more generally on numbers of watchmakers in the industry or among your peers?

NH: Our three watchmakers are a great bunch and young. Watchmaking is a very time-consuming process. I think sometimes people see the cost of the service and are shocked, but actually when you see the work that’s gone into it, you see why it’s that price.

For us, we’ve been fortunate because the School of Watchmaking is not too far away. One came to us having done horology there and we took him in, we sponsored him in his last six months, and he has come to us since and now is Rolex qualified. I think the opportunity to bring in new blood is easy. I think starting when you’ve got zero watchmakers in a workshop is very difficult. Over time we do need to keep bringing in new blood into the industry.

WI: That’s the issue, isn’t it? A lot of the watchmakers in the country are not necessarily going to still be working in 20 years’ time.

NH: I’ve travelled and seen a lot of the Rolex retailers — they do tend to have younger guys. I think it has had a bit of a resurgence as an opportunity. I also think salaries are pretty consistent and pretty reliable in that sector. It must be a rewarding job, if you’re in that mindset. There’s no expectation to botch anything. It has to be precise. It does suit a certain character type and you see a lot of those guys up and down the country. I think we are doing the majority of what we take in, in-house. We don’t do a Daytona and we don’t do Sky Dwellers. But there’s an opportunity in the next five years, once everything’s settled down, to potentially start. And Rolex may develop that apprenticeship scheme. I’m not saying that they have said that, but that there is an opportunity, especially for other retailers that haven’t got watchmakers.

WI: So, give or take a couple of Rolex models, you should be able to service in-house every watch that needs it?

NH: Well, Rolex is a 10 year service interval, isn’t it? But the main increase in terms of sales started in 2016. So I think there are a lot more watches out there. I think there was a big surge over the last few years because a lot of people were servicing watches to sell them on, especially when values were high. It hasn’t grown exponentially since and there’s a bit of a calming down at the minute, but the expectation is that it will keep growing. But then there is an opportunity to increase our output or improve efficiencies within the workshop.

WI: You mentioned earlier that you feel like you’re a custodian of the family business, but how would you like your tenure as the custodian to be defined?

NH: At the end of my career, I’d like to make sure that the business is in as strong a position as it could be, given the opportunities that I have seen come and go. There’s always my saying: “Ask the same question, get the same answer.” You’ve got to always be looking to see where the next opportunities are. I think if you’re not moving forward, you’re going backwards. Sitting back and just accepting that this is what we are doesn’t work.

Unfortunately, the high street will continue to have its own issues unless something drastically changes in terms of business rates and rent. It’s a shame that there’s so much risk to having bricks and mortar retail now for people that might have a passion project and decide to open a store as they’ve always wanted to do. There’s too much risk. Unless that changes and the high street comes back, I think we will just have to overcome all these different challenges. There will be few retailers going bit by bit. The network at our level is fairly static for now, but, generationally, there will be certain retailers that may cease to exist once they retire. All being well, if my kids are part of the team, and the same with MD Gemma’s kids, it will be in a good place. But that’s years away and I don’t really look past 10 years.

This article first appeared in the June 2026 edition of Watch Insider.